All my wiki writings, here and elsewhere, are now in the PublicDomain. – HelmutLeitner 2005-12-15 21:26 UTC

New pages: MusterTheorie, MeatBall:GimmeFive, TheHumanAsaMedium

WikiSym was a great recent experience. Lots of folks from MeatballWiki and CommunityWiki. It was like a big family meeting. Thank you to all of you.

My latest work in the field of patterns is a book, “Mustertheorie - Einführung und Perspektiven auf den Spuren von Christopher Alexander”, ISBN 39001402500. It’s a small and cheap paperback, 174 page. more... The title roughly translated: “Pattern Theory - Introduction and Perspectives on the Tracks of ChristopherAlexander”. See MusterTheorie.


Thank you for creating EgoFeature. It is a very beautiful progression of ideas that I’m finding very exhilerating to consider. I intend to respond to you there after I’ve had a chance to cogitate on it a bit longer. Thanks again for building such a wonderful page!

Thank you Brandon, it makes me happy that you see it positively, because I felt the danger to be seen as an opposing and therefore distracting and destructive force. We have many ways to look at things and interpret what we see. Common goals, values, dialogue, collaboration is natural, nevertheless.

All my writings, here and elsewhere, are now in the PublicDomain.

Wow, that’s awesome!

Bayle, thank you for noticing. This is a great experiment for me, more or less an experiment with the rest of my life. I had my 50th birthday in December and I thought that I had to look for new horizons. So I made my writings PD and my software GPL.

BTW I’ve promised to you on WikiSym to “gateway” the ProWiki software. What would the best way to go about it? Does the official UseMod release include an implementation? Or is it in the sourceforge repository?

Great, thanks! Hmm lemme see. … Answer moved to WikiGateway

Sorry for interrupting you, Helmut, but I’ve been trying to do a bit of editing on MeatBall for the past couple of weeks and always run into a never-ending “please wait … scanning your system”. Since others seem to be editing, I thought it time to ask if there is something obvious that I’m missing. Regards, – HansWobbe

Hans, I think that meatball is scanning for zombie systems to stop spam attacks, not because others are editing. It is a pain, but I think they only scan the system 3 times a month… Best, MarkDilley

Hans, it’s the same with me. On editing I have often to wait for 50-60 seconds until the edit is executed. Mark, it’s definitely not three times a month, I’m scanned each and every day. It’s a PITA.

Thank you both for commenting.

  • Mark: My comment …’since others are editing’… was not meant to be a suspicion about possible heavy usage, but rather I felt that since someone is managing to edit, I might be doing something wrong, because I can’t get through at all.
  • Helmut: I can confirm your statement that the scan is happening each and every time. Furthermore, I let it run for well over 300 seconds, assuming that it might be a slow process, but it still did not complete. Since I don’t know what they are scanning for, I can’t even guess at why it might take so long. (If they are trying to scan my disks, I’ll age visibly before they finnish.)

I would like to bring this to ChisPurcell?’s attention, but have no way of getting in touch with him, other than posting at meatball. There’s no rush, so if you could post something the next time you are editing, I’d appreciate it.

Thanks, again.

P.S. I do not know if it was a coincidence related to these posts or not, but I’ve just managed to edit MeatBall since a scan actually completed in about 1 minute.

P.P.S. Chris has engaged and all seems well, although “Who knows why.” Thanks.

Hans, I saw you writing at mb. So I assume that I don’t need to become active.

Thanks, Helmut. I intended the preceding P.P.S to indicate that somehow the situatation did clear up and I am now starting to get back into posting. My activities may (sadly) be a bit constrained by the issues surrounding my associate’s situation, but I do find it wonderfully distracting to ‘vent’ a few of my emotions via ‘calm’ posts and I hope that inspires me to keep up these efforts.

By the way, I think I said “Thanks” to you at WikiSym05 for being a good role model for me in governing my behaviour when I post. More than ever before, I really feel that, so “Thanks, again!”. I hope you all enjoy WikiSym06 and that I’ll be able to come to the next one.

Regards, Hans

P.S. I did not “clean up” by deleting the prior material that is no longer needed, but only because this is your home page.

Helmut, thanks for pointing out ChristopherAlexander. I had not come across that before.Some of the dynamics described from ThePhenomenonOfLife on the ChristopherAlexander page, are very related to what I was trying to get at in my comment on Meatball:BeyondYes. And what you suggested in StrategicDialogueSupportSoftware?, which is basically thinking about how our processes can become naturalized in their dynamics by taking on characteristics of how life naturally tends to unfold.

Hi, Helmut. On the page CommunityWikiGovernment, Lion said he believed you had indicated that you weren’t interested in holding a vote, however he didn’t seem 100% sure that he was interpreting you correctly. So, are you interested in being a voting member?

Bayle, it’s not that I’m not interested. It would be an honor for me to be a real voting member. But currently, not being able to keep up with reading half of what is written here, participating in a dozen of communities where I’m engaged in one role or the other, I just don’t have the time to deeply follow the community processes and be more than an OccasionalContributor.

OK, thanks. If you ever change your mind, let us know. And by all means, please continue to give us the benefit of your advice on things regardless.

Thank you, Bayle. I will do what I can.


I have tried both “Reply” and “Send” to respond to your email, but all attempts are failing and are generating a link like this…


I will post the content of my response on the ~HansAndHelmut? site.

Regards, Hans


If you wish to resume our “dialog”, I am quite willing to. I have not pursued the fact that it does not seem possible for me to send you email; I can receive it, but even the Rely fails. Wikis work well and I don’t mind resuming “skype”. If you have other priorities, that’s fine; I just don’t want to drop the ball through “inattention” on my part. :-) – Hans

Hans, maybe the problem comes from my splitting of the address you use (leitnerATwikiserviceDOTat) into two mail streams that are delivered separatedly at home and work. Wonder whether you requested a receipt when sending your e-mails to me. Maybe try one of helmutDOTleitnerATchelloDOTat or leitnerAThlsDOTviaDOTat directly).

Congradulations on your book! I don’t know what it says, … …but, congrats!

Lion, thank you. I’m happy to have put the ideas in a form that is recognisable by people. Our ongoing wiki discussions are of tremendous importance, because without wiki the ideas and arguments would not become clear. But on the other hand, wiki text is not a form that outsiders can recognize as a quality, it’s not a form to “sell” the results.

Wow! It’s cool that you wrote a book that is inspired by your activity on wikis. This is also awesome for your business, because it shows people a tangible example of the value that can emerge from wikis.

What Sam said.

Helmut, I’d like to invite you to either make a page on the wiki for your book (MusterTheorie?), or establish it as a local name, through CommunityLocalNames. And then link to it, from a few pages where you think it’d be relevant.

And, I agree with what you said about books vs. wiki. It might be worth talking about that further sometime here, or on MeatballWiki.

Great, let’s do this. I will explain how wiki and the mb / cw members helped me to produce the book. It will be a showcase for the book and for the power of wiki at the same time.

Congratulations on the book! Neat!


I’m just rushing to leave on a trip and I have not been able to find a valid email address so I thought I’d best post my (snail mail, office) Postal address. It’s…

 Hans Wobbe
 8 King Street East, Suite 600
 Toronto, Ontario, Canada
 M5C 1B5

I’m unlikely to have reliable internet access again before I get back during the first week of July.

Regards, – Hans

Hans, thank you for the address. I sent it today. – Helmut

Helmut… Your book arrived today. And I am already certain that I will like it. Thank you very much. - Hans

Thanks again Hellmut for your book you sent me some weeks ago already. MarkoStevelic is still reading it and explains to me about patterns sometimes. I’m looking forward to read it.

This is good to hear. Thank you.

Helmut, the word “Constructivism” is one you use so regularly, and yet still, I do not know what you mean by it.

I originally had a hard time with it, because in the books I read, “constructivism” is a school of educational thought, about how people learn by constructing models in their mind. (A further school of thought is Constructionism, which starts with the idea that one of the best ways to construct models in the mind, is to engage in actual construction projects materially.)

For what I can make so far, when you say “constructivism,” you seem to mean “creating ideas,” or “creating philosophies.” Your caution seems to be against creating philosophies and spreading them, without first testing them.

I’ve always wondered though, “Do I really understand Helmut?” It always seemed to me that there should be a ConstructivIsm?” page somewhere, because it’s an idea you reference so regularly, so methodically.

I just revisited NewRealismDiscussion.

Lion, ok, then let’s try AboutConstructivism.

Helmut, if you are around, I’d really like to discuss (or to find) about resonance in forming new communities:

  • about how posts should roughly match length with one another
  • about how interpersonal resonance is important in bonding
  • about how its the formation of the social relationships that’s really important

I remember we talked about this briefly before, but I can’t find it, and think it’s really important.

Lion, I was not around … but Mattis pointed me to your posting. I think you should find what I wrote about this searching for “reciprocity” and maybe from mb GoByCar. There was little written about resonance, which is maybe the most underestimated philosophical concept, waiting for an awakening also within pattern theory. There is a lot to say about all this, but I’ve got no time, being in the final stage before a big software project delivery. – Helmut

Understood, and thank you for the attention.



Define external redirect: ConstructivIsm HansAndHelmut StrategicDialogueSupportSoftware ChisPurcell

EditNearLinks: OccasionalContributor ProWiki GoByCar MeatballWiki UseMod MeatBall ThePhenomenonOfLife ChristopherAlexander


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